What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

The elections are comming, everyone hates republicans...
I'm almost positive that the Democrates are going to take contol.. You know they are 100% Anti-Gun and want to control everything and your 1st right to go will be Right to bear and own firearms...
Lets not debate if that can or can't... Say they do... (I really afraid this is going to be a reality)

I know a few of you will chest beat and say "They never get mine" or "I'll be waiting"...
Not to sound like someone else here, but you will have no choice and if you resist, I can't see you lasting long... I don't have a chart or anything, but I just can't see it...

At any rate, What type of weapons and training would you then gather to protect you and yours???


I think you will have this to worry about long before your FRNs will no longer buy milk and TP...

So lets see what you would use...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Get what guns :dontknow: sold all mine back when I sold my PMs.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Well a compound bow wouldn't be a bad choice. Cuts through Kevlar like a hot knife through butter. Fairly silent and deadly.

Close combat nothing beats a sword. If it's sharp enough should be able to kill with one blow, sever arms, head.

I would recommend some MMA to brush up your hand to hand skills and increase your speed, strength and dexterity. Skills learned will transfer over to weapons to a certain extent.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I believe there will be quite a few firearms reported stolen or lost in "boating accidents" if this ever came to pass.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I don't think it make a lot of sense to waste time on purely academic questions such as this.

This ISN'T going to happen in my lifetime ( say about 20-30 years that I have left ). No way is the govt going to come right out and "ban" firearms.
There are 80 to 150 million of them in this country, depending on whose stats you believe, and there are enough people that have them that WOULD go to war over this that unless the Govt plan is to actually cause a civil war, this ain't gonna happen. This is NOT chest beating, but there are simply enough gun owners in this country who know WHY they own them.....and it ain't about duck hunting.

The plan is a much slower boiling of the frog.....chip at this, chip at that, tax something else, until you have effectively banned them without an outright ban. I have no doubt this is the eventual goal, but I do doubt they will pull it off in the time I have left.

What would make MORE sense is to dicuss how to increase interests of today's youth in shooting sports and hunting......trash their fricking video games and get them out into the real world. We went on a group campout of a "survival" forum couple years ago, and the gal that organized it kid brought a pocket full of portable video games and spent the entire 4 days sitting in chair playing them. If it were my kid or grandkid, I'd have pitched them as far out in the lake as I could have thrown, and said "Now, boy....let's go for a walk and see the real world."

The only chance I see that we have of retaining gun ownership down the road to teach the youth of today what guns are all about, and why they should own/learn to use them.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

And I always ask "WHY ?"......because if you're not willing to use them in the face of obvious tyranny, why the heck bother to keep them at all ?

What the heck is the point ?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

How would we know ,thanks to corp media?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Well there was one old lady who did and they body checked her and took her to one of the "emergency centers." Of course she wasn't even pointing it at them just didn't hand it over. Too bad I don't know where to get a clip of this. I would think they would make an example out of them to discourage others in the future.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Exactamundo Floyd.....and since I wasn't there, I sure don't know.

Thorgrim.....I understand what you are saying......but I guess I'm getting old enough that I can see the end in sight anyway. Personally, and this is JUST for me, I have no intent of living out my last days as anybody's slave. Principle is just becoming more important as I ferment......ahahahaa...

Like today.....guy gave me a check for some work I did for him. I go to HIS bank to cash it. I smear my thumbprint on it and give the teller my driver's license......she looks at my thumprint and says "You'll need to redo it, make it clearer " as if they could actually USE the dadgum thing for anything anyway.....so I did. Then she takes my license over to her computer and enters the number and does God knows what in the way of info searching.....THEN she comes back to the window and says "And you KNOW there is a 3 dollar charge for cashing this since you are NOT ( and sorta says it with a sneer ) a customer here, right ?"

"Uh, no, that's the first I knew of it......and I'm not paying it....give me the check back. I'll return it to the guy that wrote it, let HIM come down to HIS bank and get HIS money out HIMSELF, and maybe discuss ya'll's customer friendly attitude while YOU use his money to make money".......and with that, I went out to the truck, called the guy, told him the story, and said I'd be by tommorrow for the cash.....and suggested maybe he might want to find a nicer bank.

Just 3 bucks.....not a big deal......but anybody that pays me in the future with a check on that bank will get it handed right back to them before the ink dries.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I hate Hillary and the democrats even more than Bush, thats a lot of hate.
If hillary becomes president and orders a gun confiscation I know I won't be thinking clearly, so I don't know what I would do until the time comes.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

:thumbs up

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Andy - Bank of America is charging $5 per check. Add them to your do not accept list.:coolbeer:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I read several years ago that the average age of hunters nationwide was over 40.
Young people are just not taking up hunting and haven't for years.

This is another issue encroaching on firearms ownership.
In a few years if a hunting lic is required for ownership. We will be left with an old very small group of legitimate owners.

If a person keeps one registered gun and one unregistered gun of the same caliber and model he would be able to just go ahead and hand over the registered weapons along with a small quanity of ammo in the unlikely event you were required to turn them in.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Andy? if 12 ATF agents comes to you house and you are alone and they asked you for your weapons then what the heck are you going to do?

I for one don't keep any in my property but I am able to get to them in ten to fifteen minutes........ there is a time and place for everything, a time to say "I don't have any" and a time to fight them.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

smullen, I have no idea as to who you are, where you are, your experience level with firearms or the ins and outs of your situation. However, based on the above, I'll take a stab at the question.

Get a simple revolver... a handgun with a "spinning" or revolving cylinder that holds the bullets. Normally the revolver will hold 6 rounds or bullets. Look for a .38 caliber or a .357 caliber.

The revolver has been around for ages, is dependable and designed for "dummies". Easy to point & shoot, reliable in the dark and inexpensive.
Ammo is plentiful, easily accessed and cheap.

Some folks might steer you toward a semi-automatic (a magazine fed weapon as opposed to a "revolving" cylinder weapon) however a GREAT first handgun and defensive weapon remains the revolver. With the correct ammo (125 grain, half-jacketed hollowpoint bullets) in a $100.00 classified ad, you'll be able to knock a lot of bad guys on their asses.

Training? I have plenty...but if I was brand new to gun ownership, I'd call a gun shop and be totally honest with the person I spoke to. I'd tell them that I bought a 38 or 357 revolver and wanted to get proficient with it for my personal protection. I'd ask about classes or even tutoring. Betcha that a guy like me will answer the phone and for $15. per hour and YOUR ammo, I'd teach you all you want.

Guns are not that intimidating once you've handled them for awhile.

Best of luck.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Ponce:

If 12 thieves came to your door and said "We are going to take everything in this house because there are more of us than you....", what would you do ? Hand them everything with a smile ?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

If the government decides to collect firearms they'll do it. Like they did in New Orleans. People were in their own homes, they came in, hand cuffed them and took their guns.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

First, the NUMBER of firearms currently in circulation are approximately 300 MILLION. The number of firearms OWNERS are 80 MILLION.

If you don't MOVE after it becomes apparent that firearms confiscation will begin, then you WILL lose your weapons. BUT, for that to occur, the US MILITARY will have to be 'stood down' because they cannot be 'trusted' to actually confiscate US citizens firearms. And neither can the local law enforcement agencies.

This basically means that whoever makes the requests to the UN will be requesting FOREIGN troops to come onto US soil to confiscate all weapons.

THIS WILL BE A HUGE PR PROBLEM. Plus this will signal the begining of the Second US Revolution.

Have a happy day...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Andy? I said "ATF" ....... no weapons in the house so they are welcome to look. ...... if you think that I am going to fight 12 of the ATF then you are nuts.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Ponce:

Yep....I got your position, and I understand what you're gonna do if 12 'authorized' thieves wearing AFT jackets show up and 'only' want your firearms.

Now back to my question.....If 12 regular, armed thieves show up, what's the plan ?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Ponce and Tn Andy,

What's the difference? Both are 12 strong and are there uninvited. Neither group will leave empty handed. OK, the ATF might actually let you live to go to jail. The theives won't.

So, what's the diff? And what's the plan? Run and hide? Just curious.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

After all our equip. is eaten up in Iraq and the money is gone it will be the only way to defend themselves.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Tn ... Andy-

We're about the same age.

Were you a Boy Scout? I was.

Maybe I still am, at least the way Scouts were
almost fifty years ago.

"Be prepared"

and dtnwn

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Ponce,

First of all the BATF, FBI and FEMA have no business on my property. After Ruby Ridge, Waco, and a few other unconstitutional intrusions like New Orleans and Sanabel Island in Florida, they are the enemy. Local Law Enforcement gets a break, but thats only becouse they are up to they're necks in drug dealers and local thugs. I have never nor would I ever participate in such crap, and I would/ have turn in that kind of vermin.

Just 12?

That leaves 8 rounds in my first magazine.

I have 10 more magazines with 20 rounds each.

And that's just the H&k.

My other goodies can accept 50 round magazines.

Could it be a Thompson?

Wallew is more right on than you realise. That flap over the little question on the test was real and the government was not pleased about the answer ( for those of you whom may not know, a questionaire was circulated in the 80's. One of the questions was if whether or not you could order troops to fire on civilians under the guise of mandatory firearms confiscation. This "blew" up in the faces of TPTB. Some very good Officers resigned they're commisions outright, others answered negativly and were purged.) Still another group played the game, gave the "correct" answer and let TPTB think that they won. Little did TPTB realise that all the did was create an Army within the Army. Watching. Waiting.

Waco almost did it. Came really close to unleashing the beast. If all of the facts we know about that now were known then, it would have. Hindsight being what it is, I'm kinda glad that it didn't. It would have been a shame to have played the trump card too soon. As it was, it did spread this "group" to other branches of the military. Watching. Waiting.

What TPTB pulled off in New Orleans was BS and they know it. The total percentage of what was stolen from law abiding citizens is a grain of sand on the beach. And it would appear to be the plan in the future, The same crap was pulled in Florida during the last couple of Hurricanes, most notably on Sanabel Island. Have several friends that lost gun collections as well as jewels and gold/silver. Thats what lead me to this site.

My Sister is an attorney down in Florida. Fresh out of college she took a job with the state and her task was to rewrite the verbage in Florida laws that dealt with mandatory evacuations. Even had a FEMA goon oversee this process every step of the way. She was a good girl and did her job, but she also saw to it to tell me and now I'm telling you. If you have to, take your goodies first. Don't give them up to nobody, don't leave your PM's behind. No one in federal law enforcement is a friend. They are all sheep of the worst order, and IMHO, to be shot on sight.

Yep, thats dangerous talk. Yes it gets you on the List. Big Deal! I'm already on the LIST anyway. So is everyone that is a member of or has looked at this board. Matter of fact, Ponce, you are considered a very dangerous man and I'll bet that if I were privy, your dossier is about 2 feet thick.

Scary stuff, and you should be scared. Fear is a good thing. It keeps you from burning your hand on the stove. At the same time lets face it. When it all comes down, some of us are going to get killed. But as Andy wrote once, no one gets out alive anyway. The real question becomes will it be on your feet or on your knees. Besides, hell, we might even name a school after you Ponce. Call it the Ponce college of hard knocks.

That being said, While I don't know you personly, I do respect you Ponce.
and I'm glad you came back to the board. Your insightfull and witty and of the grit we will need when TSHTF. America needs more men like you.

:coolbeer:


DBD

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Yep. Eagle.....class of '65.

Sets a pattern for life.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../70px-CFJ3.jpg

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Damn it! I am on the list again? First, when they finger printed me in the army and trained me how to kill. Second, when I bought the AR-15 because it felt most like the M-16 that I was trained to kill with. Now you tell me this board puts me on the list again? Damn it! Damn it! Damn it!

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I'll bet not many on this board know where The State of Franklin is located. It's just up the road from me. Andy might know.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I'd wager almost none on this board have ever heard of the Lost State of Frankland.

There is clear anti-government history here in Tennessee, and more so in the eastern mountains.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_of_Franklin

The State of Franklin was an autonomous, secessionist territory created in western North Carolina and eastern Tennessee in the United States not long after the end of the American Revolution. Franklin was never officially admitted into the Union of the United States and lasted only four years.

Now let's talk about the Conch Republic !

http://www.conchrepublic.com/history.htm

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

You want to talk about being 'on the list'?

Let's see.

Top Secret Clearance back in the mid eighties as the DP manager for a shipyard that did work on the USS Enterprise. She ran across a sand bar south of San Diego. Then had to make her way up to San Francisco Bay area with about an eighty foot gash in her hull below waterline.

When I signed up for gunsmithing school, my information was sent to the BATF for 'approval'. Then the school sent the BATF the same info stating that I had 'graduated'.

A member of WAY TOO MANY websites just like this one. I have been thrown off of many of them, as I just don't 'fit in' like most good little lemmings.

So yah, you betcha. MY FILE is probably way thick by now as well. Of course, everybody KNOWS that those files are now digital info stored somewhere in Maryland at the NSA's huge computer facility forty feet below ground, right? OOPS, another entry on my file.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Umm, Maybe I misunderstood, but I think you mis-read my question/Post...

I posed the question/situation of what weapons/training would you get if """FireArms""" were outlawed and confiscated??? Not, Hey, I'm new to firearms and ammo, could someone teach me about them...

But, I do thank you for your advice anyway... It sounded like a pretty decent suggestions to give someone who has never picked up or had any experience with firearms...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

watch this tiny video before thinking that any of you "patriots" can take on our own military wtshtf:

http://www.4th25.com/video/apache.mpg

just a bunch of old guys typing bravado on your keyboards. go rent braveheart and watch mel gibson get it at the end. silly thread here.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Hey Coin.....the best helicopter in the world is still an out of service piece of junk if it needs one critical "O" ring for a hydraulic system. You don't have to attack a superior machine (or force) directly.......you take on the E-3 driving the supply truck, then burn the truck.

And go rent Kindergarten Cop......much more fun.

"IT'S NOT A TUMOR !!!"

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Easy there trigger... Don't try to read where I aint writing... :)

I wasn't posting about Bucking the Military, stating a revolution, civil war or any other militant plans...

I was posing the question, of which I and I'm sure atleast a few others can see as a reality, some time in the future...

A lot of people choose to own firearms for protection of self and property from the Non guberment thugs that come you house at 2 am looking to rape your wife or take your VCR, to score some (insert favorite drug here)... Not everyone owns firearms because they think they are Rambo or they theink they can take on the Military or Police...

I'm not going to list my whole collection as it doesn't really matter...

Currently, I keep a 12ga Mossberg within quick grasp and a Glock 21, not much futher, in case someone breaks in... I know them both well (even in the dark) so

I feel pretty confident and safe with them around...

I guess if those things are outlawed and confiscated... I'll have to put better locks on the doors and start using the house alarm...

For weapons, in case they get in, I guess I'd have to rely on my hand to hand skills, a pair of Ninja Swords, several decent knives I have (folding and Fixed), a few Aluminum bats, a stungun, and a crossbow... Althought I dunno, how quick I could load and fire a Crossbow if the need come up... I really need some practice on that...

Those listed above and two barking and Yiping dogs... A Black Lab/Rott and even worse a Killer mix of Pug/Poodle...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Now isn't that what I've been saying all along, Wallew? Our own soldiers confiscated guns in New Orleans, without any major opposition from the "patriotic Americans". Hurricane Katrina was an emergency situation and like 9-11, the population gladly submitted to the powers for safety and security. While being called a defeatist and a suicidal cop-out, I have tried to say that the same people who are supposed to hold back this infringement upon their freedoms are the ones giving it away.

Where is the Patriot fight against Yahoo and AOL for giving the government their users' internet searches? I thought we were supposed to be secure in our houses, persons and papers from unreasonable searches and seizures? Oh, yeah it's to hunt child predators--that's a noble enough cause. After all, if you're not a child predator, you've got nothing to worry about, right? Where is the Patriot fight against AT&T and Bell South for providing phone records for the CIA? Where is the Revolution against Eminent Domain? Where is the fight against the credit card companies--you read the back of the application and they tell you that they've got to tell the government you're opening an account because of the Patriot Act. Where's the Patriot's fight against warrantless wiretapping? Where is the Patriot fight against the Federal Reserve and the illegal usurption (is that a word?) of our Congress' power to coin and regulate its own currency?

The reason the President goes unchecked in his powers is because the people who are supposed check him have long been overcome by fear and the pride of nationalism. There have been so many attacks on the liberties of Americans, liberties "Patriots" have been all too willing to give away, but it's inconceivable that wholesale gun confiscation could take place? Furthermore, the foreign troops are going to be infinitely more brutal and unsympathetic. Like Hurricane Katrina, another emergency, terror-related or otherwise, is going to be the only catalyst they will need. They already have the submission of the people. They have thus far consolidated untold of unconstitutional power because there is no Revolutionary-War era Patriotic opposition.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I have a honest question... Why would UN or others risk their own
lives to disarm the US?

They have to know they will be shot at. :eek:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Won' be no risked lives. It's called incrementalism. Like what's been going on in Mexifornia with 50 cal, +10round mags, so-called assault weapons with those very lethal pistol grips, and deadly bayonet lugs. Now they are about to pass legislation requiring a weapon to leave an identifying mark on the shell casing.... little here, little there. Put the gun shops out of biz, require licenses before the populace are allowed to exercise their 2nd Amendment rights, more laws, more lawsuits....... registration. Then, once registered comes the knock knock/we know ya got em/give em. Remember, government is force at the end of a gun. The Constitution is about the only thing standing in the way of the UN and NWOers.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

It's one thing to tax somthing out of existiance, but it's another to go knocking
door to door to collect them. I sure as hell wouldn't want that assignment.

I firmly believe that when you outlaw guns / drugs / insert contraband
here, only outlaws will have them.

If there is a demand for a item, there will be a black market for them

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Very True.

The Second Ammendment gives you Arms, not bullets

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Arms are not arms without bullets. Like a knife is not a knife without a blade.

A Gun without Bullets is just a Club.
Credit my Brother with that one.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

If that day comes and I hope it doesnt. I would do my second amendment duty and SHOOT and KILL as many of the tyrants as possible.

Thomas Jefferson said something about the tree of liberty needing to be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants or something along those lines...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

[quote=Civilutionary;346287]Now isn't that what I've been saying all along, Wallew? Our own soldiers confiscated guns in New Orleans, without any major opposition from the "patriotic Americans". Hurricane Katrina was an emergency situation and like 9-11, the population gladly submitted to the powers for safety and security. While being called a defeatist and a suicidal cop-out, I have tried to say that the same people who are supposed to hold back this infringement upon their freedoms are the ones giving it away.
[quote]

Hold on there! Anyone left in NO after Katrina were NOT patriots, 90% of them were the dregs of society. What do you expect from those that live on welfare? And the police confiscating guns WERE NOT U.S. Military, they were California Highway Patrol!

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Here are some words that will land you on a "List"

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Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Yes Very True.

Watch, next they will outlaw clubs

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

So how many lists did you just get on by posting this "list"?

:haha:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I think it's fair to assume "all of them". :rofl: :rofl:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

If you dont think your on a list already, ur nuts...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I heard some time ago (pre-911) that the average American was on over 200 databases. :eek:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Ok, first and foremost I would like you to show HARD EVIDENCE of US MILITARY 'confiscating guns'. While there WERE a few weapons confiscated from little old ladies who lived by themselves, it's funny you didn't see them 'confiscating guns' from whole neighborhoods who stood watch 24/7 and did NOT allow anyone in who did not belong there. If they had, THE WHOLE NEIGHBORHOOD would have cut them to pieces.

But then you probably believe there was mass rape, murder, etc occuring in the SUPER DOME. Which also proved unfounded. AND NO REACTION? Please, you REALLY need to keep up. Several Congress critters and Senators have already started the legislative process to make sure that never occurs again.

Plus, in MOST instances that I CAN PROVE, it's the LOCAL COPS. That's it. NO SOLDIERS. Though Blackwater did start patrolling some areas. But it's funny how if an area was already 'patrolled' by the local neighborhood you just didn't see ANY LEO's ANYWHERE.

So, give HARD PROOF that what you say occured ACTUALLY DID. Like I said, a few single individuals did get roughed up and had a few weapons confiscated. Not one 'assault rifle' was IN any of the 'confiscated guns'. NOT ONE.

And lots of people who came to 'help' came in armed. Want some proof. Read this one:

http://lonestar-mvpa.org/events/2005/05_Katrina.htm

Start at 'DAY 7' ...

So enough with the military confiscating weapons. It just DID NOT HAPPEN. SORRY. If you can PROVE IT, PLEASE DO SO.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

J in AZ,
Let me help you out here. The first part about 'mental defectives' with that 'few hundred thousand rounds'? It was called Waco.

What percentage of firearms owners have a stockpile of ammo?

EVERY ONE I KNOW. Of course, as a gunsmith, most of the people I know are all 'gun addicts'. And it's NOT UNUSUAL for them to have better than ten thousand rounds. Some have LOTS MORE than that. If you legally own an automatic weapon, TRUST ME, you gonna have a whole lot more ammo stockpiled than ten thousand rounds. That's a good three day shoots worth. Some guys I know with full autos buy them by the truck load.

But I AM a member of the gun culture myself. And just so you know, the easiest way to get rid of ammo is to price it out of range of most shooters. THAT has already started happening. Less than one year ago, you could purchase a case (1000 rounds) of 7.62x39 for less than $100 shipped. That price has doubled. And it's on the way to topping $300. Yet real 'gunnies' that I know just keep buying it up. They figure that it won't be going down any time soon.

Hope that helps.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Come on now, Bugs Bunny will get you onna list?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Excellent. My dad hunted each twilight for table meat as a boy and considered teaching all his children, boys and girls, to shoot as important as how to do simple wiring, carpentry, gardening, car repair, and plumbing. Basic life skills.

He started us with water guns then on to bb, pellet and finally in our early teens, regular firearms. He let us help with remodeling chores he was doing, which we considered a treat.

Kids who do not get taught basic life skills are very helpless.

In the video I saw from NO neither the rich who stayed nor the poor who stayed gave up arms willingly. Some projects drove off the mercenaries with fire, and a white lawyer in his mansion kept his too, with threats of legal retribution if they did not leave him the :censored: alone.

After seeing Katrina I think lots of people know Blackwater is not your friend. Making your town into Falluja is not a friendly act.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Firearms
 

.

Coin

With all due respect, you have NOT been paying attention.

Never said a word about taking on the big bad old U.S. Military.

Quite the contrary, THEY ARE ON OUR SIDE. At least the best troops that matter.

http://www.eoffshore.com/resister.htm

http://www.eoffshore.com/

These are public and available for anyone to browse, I am not betraying any confidence here.

As far as the Apache Helicopter is concerned, as a former Apache mechanic I can honestly say that while it is a formidable weapons platform, it is very maintainance dependant. As TN Andy has already alluded, one critical o-ring, one critical hydraulic hose, an out of balance rotor blade, and your precious technological nightmare is little more than a very expensive hanger queen.

As an amateur engineer (took the classes, and then said shove your degree) I believe in what another great engineer once said "The more you overtake the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain"
Lieutenant Commander Montgomery Scott

And if you had any military experience, you would also realise that as one of murphy's 10 laws of combat, your weapons system is manufactured by the lowest bidder giving out the highest kickback. Weapons manufacturers are in business to make money, they couldn't give a damn less about the lives of our troops and success on the battlefield. They want stuff (the M-1 Abrams hydrostatic hub, for example) to break. They do not care if they lose a little profit on the system they manufacture, because they make that back 10 fold on replacement parts and the consumable materials to keep it all going.

Yep, good old William Wallace bought it. Got killed, offed, snuffed, wicked, waisted, executed, and otherwise met an untimely demise. So?
As a result of his sacrifice the Scotish People became one great big giant pain in the ass for the British Monarchy for the next 800 yrs. or so. William Wallace died for what he believed in without reservation or purpose of evasion. And he died for freedom without compromise. Told big, bad old Edward the Longshanks to get screwed and that is not the point. The point is that, and it is what ultimately separates us from the mere primates, we have some choice in our ultimate demise.

Thats right, on your feet or on your knees. Like a man or like a common whore. I kidded Ponce about naming a school or something in his honor, but last I knew, no whore is ever remembered in all of recorded history.
Patton said it best, which would you rather have. I fought in the great WWII or I shoveled shit in Louisiana.

Freedom my friend is an expensive way of life. As a free man you may be called upon to sacrifice all that you hold so dear. Sometime it might be in the face of tyranny. Or it might be in the face of a criminal thug. And to quote the Great William Wallace, "You can take my life, but you will never take my freedom."


DBD

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I tried to tell 'em, but they ain't listening. :Zzzz:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

EXCELLENT advice Andy! It is important that those raising kids now, take this advice to heart.

And you are absolutely right about this:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

[QUOTE=mtnman;346467][quote=Civilutionary;346287]Now isn't that what I've been saying all along, Wallew? Our own soldiers confiscated guns in New Orleans, without any major opposition from the "patriotic Americans". Hurricane Katrina was an emergency situation and like 9-11, the population gladly submitted to the powers for safety and security. While being called a defeatist and a suicidal cop-out, I have tried to say that the same people who are supposed to hold back this infringement upon their freedoms are the ones giving it away.
Are you kidding me? Welfare? I don't believe for once instance that those on welfare don't have constitutional rights, but we're not talking about the 9th Ward, we're talking about Middle-Class, law-abiding, tax-paying Americans who had their guns unlawfully confiscated. Does it matter WHO took them--whoever took them, they had no business doing so. I got news for ya, pal...the 90% "dregs of society" weren't the only ones left in N.O. after Katrina.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Okay, so maybe I spoke too hastily. Maybe it wasn't the U.S. MILITARY (though when I watched the footage of it happening, I thought I saw them, my mistake). Does it change the fact that the unlawful confiscation of firearms happened? While I don't believe the U.S. military by and large would be willing to disarm Americans, some will + U.N. foreign troops. It's going to be a civil war, too. Because folks aren't going to stand for it. So, it's really going to be more like a revolutionary war because Americans are going to have to fight TPTB who will tell them they don't have constitutional rights to ANYTHING, let alone the right to bear arms. We survivalists need to get this in our heads: without the Constitution, we have no power, legality or rights to bear arms. So, the foreign troops are going to have the green light to use FORCE. They're already well aware that Americans are going to resist confiscation.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

The majority of gun owners will gladly go along with it and turn theirs in, got to keep US safe you know. That will drastically reduce the number left to assault.

The government would first collect firearms from the willing, and destroy the corresponding 4473 forms.

Then, they will start going after the known gun owners, those who were buying large amounts of ammo, or firearms and leaving a paper trail (if you used a credit card etc), or somehow got on their watch lists.

Then they will go after the rest. Rewards will be offered so your friends, neighbors, and family will be eager to turn you in.

They will probably go into victims homes while they are at work, and take everything they want. That way, they don't have to fight it out.

Don't think it won't happen, don't think it cannot happen, don't think the pigs will not gladly go along with it. Look at New Orleans. Pigs are neck deep in debt, probably worse than the rest of us because they are naturally stupid. They will follow orders before they lose their homes, cars, and everything else they owe on.

Remember the brave, heroic Chippy who tackled the old lady because she had a snubby for self protection. Burn that memory into your mind. The pigs had no problem with enforcing unlawful orders then, they will have no problem doing it in the future. I've seen pigs on gun boards openly say they will enforce the law, regardless of what that law is.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

There was a NOPD dectective on another board who said the military\ng WAS confiscating firearms. Supposedly, some of the better LE with NOPD were following up with the out of state pigs and military and telling them who was and was not "allowed to keep their firearm".

He said, that a lot of people had their firearms returned quickly after being taken, when NOPD found that those people could keep them. I guess those with permits.

My acquired distrust of pigs made me take it with a grain of salt. If you want the scoop, go to Black Rifles.com and search for user 'Scotchmcdrinkerbean', or something like that. Search for the time a month or two after Katrina. It took him a while to get back online and start with sitreps. It was interesting reading.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I'm with you ALL the way on what you're saying. I really don't think that Americans today have the bravery of the Founders. I also don't think that our military will be heros WTSHTF. I mean, geez, look at Iraq..."Alright boys, time to go to Iraq. We gotta get them WMDs. Yes, sir! Well, boys, we never did find them WMDs, but we got rid of Saddam Hussein. The world's a better place without him! Yes, sir!!" Where is the fortitude to question the leadership? Where will the fortitude be when the next 9-11 happens and they're all convinced that following their leaders' orders are their patriotic duty?

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

I knew I wasn't hallucinating. Wallew, any comments on that? :smokin:

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Our ONLY hope in that situation will be that the officers remember their oath. The grunt will do what he is told to do, or he will be shot.

I saw an poll linked on a gun board years ago that basically asked GI's if they would participate in gun confiscation if ordered. I forget the exact number, but IIRC, 90+% answered that they would. It was a STUNNING realization.

The grunts don't think. If you think about who in modern day America goes into the military as enlisted.... not meant to offend, but it's not exactly college graduates or people who turned down scholarships. It is mostly those who had few other options. That doesn't diminish their service, or their sacrifice.

On top of that, the public school system has effectively dumbed our society down to the point that most GI's probably cannot tell you 4 elements\amendments\principles of the Bill of Rights. I am always surprised at how many college grads I encounter who think "separation of church and state", that exact wording, is written in the BOR.

It is a scary thing to see just how little a modern day college graduate understands about our constitution, our liberty, where we get that liberty, and our government.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

LIKE I SAID, IF YOU DON'T MOVE when you KNOW this is going to happen, YOU WILL LOSE your firearms. And the old 'what firearms' will get YOU hauled off to jail until you give them up. PONCE, just because they are NOT on your premises does NOT mean YOU will be allowed to just be left alone to go get them later.

So, if you WANT to fight this fight, be prepared to move locations. And I don't mean across the street or across town. You will need to relocate. Because you would be surprised HOW difficult it is for these people to keep up with the massive amount of people that move around.

Now, if they FIRST ring each large city (135 of them over 150,000 people - that's 95% of the population) and you live in one of those cities, you are hosed. Think about Warsaw in Poland during WWII. The Germans ringed the city. Then went house to house destroying pretty much everything. Finally ended up with the Jews left in a given section. They tried to starve them out. They tried to hunt them out. They FINALLY ended up burning it to the ground. Very few survived. BUT at least a small band of them fought the great German war machine to a stand still for several weeks. Which is WHY the Germans burned the place to the ground.

History is about to repeat itself. Our leaders won't hesitate to use foreign troops on our soil to get what they want. Hey, a bunch of US citizens die in the process? No problem to them. We don't matter because we won't just roll over.

So, be PREPARED to move OR give up your firearms OR DIE.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Several things. FIRST was they NEVER actually came across ANYONE who stood up to them. The people in 'rich neighborhoods' just rolled over. One house at a time.

Did you ACTUALLY read any of the other stuff posted there? Like this little ditty about the South Central LA riots?

"But not everybody in Los Angeles suffered," Pratt said. "In some of the hot spots, Korean merchants were able to successfully protect their stores with semi-automatic firearms. In areas where armed citizens banded together for self-protection, their businesses were spared while others -- which were left unprotected -- burned to the ground."


This next quote is about Katrina and is EXACTLY what I am talking about.

"It was pandemonium for a couple of nights," said Charlie Hackett, a New Orleans resident. "We just felt that when [looters] got done with the stores, they’d come to the homes."

Hackett was right... which is why he and his neighbor, John Carolan, stood guard over their homes to ward off looters who, rummaging through the neighborhoods, were smashing windows and ransacking stores.
Armed looters did eventually come to Carolan's house and demanded his generator. But Carolan showed them his gun and they left.

No wonder then that gun stores, which weren't under water, were selling firearms at a record pace to people looking to defend themselves. "I've got people like you wouldn't believe, lots of people, coming in and buying handguns," said Briley Reed, the assistant manager of the E-Z Pawn store in Baton Rouge.

"I've even had soldiers coming in here buying guns," Reed said.

Makeshift militias patrol neighborhoods
In the Algiers neighborhood of New Orleans, dozens of neighbors banded together to protect their neighborhood.

"There's about 20 or 30 guys in addition to us. We know all of them and where they are," Gregg Harris said. "People armed themselves so quickly, rallying together. I think it's why [our] neighborhood survived."

Harris isn't joking about the armaments. A gun battle erupted one afternoon between armed neighbors and looters. Two of the thugs were shot.

Since then, no more looters have bothered the neighborhood. But the neighbors aren't letting their guard down. They all take their turn keeping watch.

Gareth Stubbs sits in a rocking chair on his front porch, holding his shotgun and a bottle of bug spray.

In another home, a 74-year old mother keeps the following near the bed: her rosary, a shotgun and a 38-caliber pistol.

Vinnie Pervel and two other volunteers man a balcony-turned-watchtower with five borrowed shotguns, a pistol, a flare gun, and old AK-47 and loads of ammunition.

To be sure, many of the weapons were borrowed from neighbors who fled before the storm hit. Pervel and Harris did not have any working firearms themselves in the aftermath of the storm. But because Pervel had been keeping in contact (via phone) with neighbors who had already evacuated, he got permission to go into the vacant homes and get his neighbors' weapons.

"I never thought I'd be going into my neighbor's house and taking their guns," Pervel said. "We wrote down what gun came from what house so we can return them when they get back."

Firearms were a hot commodity
It would be an understatement to say that firearms were the hottest commodity in the days following the massive destruction. In Gulf Port, Mississippi, Ron Roland, 51, lost everything -- three homes, four cars, a bait-and-tackle shop and a boat. It was all destroyed by Hurricane Katrina.

Nevertheless, Roland was determined to salvage what he could amidst the rubble -- with or without police protection. And it's a good thing, too, because there would be no such thing as "police protection" in the days following the storm.

Standing guard over one of his homes with a handgun in his waistband, Roland used his firearm to stop looters from rummaging through his storm-damaged property.

Roland and his son even performed a citizen's arrest on one plunderer and then warned future thieves by posting the following message in his yard: "NO TRESPASSERS! ARMED HOMEOWNERS." Signs like this were common throughout the Gulf Coast region in the days following Katrina.

Now just for the record. YOU GOT ONE VIDEO that shows TWO people in plastic cuffs in one scene and ONE GUY in plastic cuffs in another scene. You've got another video (that will not load right now, though I have seen it) that shows the police mistreating a REALLY OLD LADY. So, lets see, that FOUR PEOPLE TOTAL. FOUR. And ALL of this occurs in neighborhoods where things are fairly intact. You DID NOTICE THAT, RIGHT? Not a lot of devastiation in that 'rich' neighborhood.

What you DON'T SEE is these same military units rolling into neighborhoods where signs have been sprayed on walls and pieces of plywood saying "YOU LOOT, WE SHOOT". Didn't see that, DID YOU? Why not? Because it would have take a company of men, which they DIDN'T HAVE to even ATTEMPT to disarm an organized neighborhood of thirty or forty well armed and DETERMINED home owners. Determined. As in they had ALREADY SHOT looters. Do you ACTUALLY think they view the military as any different? These people aren't the ones whining about 'who's going to SAVE ME'. THESE PEOPLE WERE READY. Food, water, generator, and most importantly, WEAPONS TO KEEP IT ALL SAFE.

So, WHAT DO YOU SAY ABOUT THAT? This is EXACTLY what I said earlier. You REALLY gotta stop believing all the media accounts of how bad things were. And START reading actual accounts like the one I POSTED of people who not only went there to help, but went there armed and ready to defend what they brought in. I kind of doubt ANY kind of hijacker would have been successful with the Sarge in his deuce. Armed as he was. If it had been me? I'd have added a folding AK with a large bag of magazines already loaded. But that's just me. If you are going to present force, present MASSIVE FORCE and USE IT.

You had one shot in that ABC video of two guys going up a set of stairs with their rifles at the ready. Looked really cool, right? The only problem was they were extremely exposed. Two guys, STUCK ON A STAIRCASE. While the home owners pop out from hiding on the first floor with semi auto rifles would have cut them in half. IN ABOUT TWO SECONDS. Those guys were hamming it up for the cameras. So that ABC could run a story about 'weapons confiscation'. Didn't see the old Police Cheif out there 'rounding up weapons' did you? HELL NO. He's NOT that stupid. He held a press conference and called it a day. He didn't ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING.

Neither did ANY of the OTHER law enforcement units. You got one unit, going into EMPTY HOUSES. Except in the 'rich neighborhoods' where they actually found THREE PEOPLE to harass. OH, YEAH. THE WHOLE CITY UNDER MARTIAL LAW. EVERY FIREARM CONFISCATED.

GET REAL! NOT ONE actual event where anyone was not only prepared but DETERMINED not to 'give away' their freedoms was ever shown because it NEVER HAPPENED.

And did you ACTUALLY COUNT the number of 'officers and military people' doing all this confiscation? TOTAL ON CAMERA PERSONNEL were less than twenty. I actually counted sixteen.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

You're arguing semantics. At first you said that it wasn't the military, but clearly, it was. Then you make out the Special Forces (in another post) to be the bastions of protection, when they were caught on film butchering innocent civilians at Waco, Texas. It doesn't matter HOW MANY soldiers were involved or HOW MANY guns were taken. NOT ONE SINGLE SOLDIER SHOULD'VE HAVE TAKEN ONE SINGLE GUN PROTECTED BY THE CONSTITUTION. You do understand that, DON'T YOU? You're right about a well-armed populace, but it doesn't change the fact that the government uses national emergencies and terrorism to assault the constitutional rights of Americans. You could go on ALL DAY about what you would do if the government banned firearms and came for yours. What I am trying to beat into some of your heads is that without the Constitution, you won't have the legal right to resist, unless you are ready to fight another civil and revolutionary war.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Firearms
 

DBD.....THAT was worth repeating !!!

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

The military and law enforcement communities have been watching and waiting for 150 years. It's time to shit or get off the pot. I'm not expecting to be saved from the system by its own institutions.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

A couple of things JUMP OUT at me while rewatching that video. FIRST, my count was off by EIGHT people on camera as the total looks like 26, but I could be incorrect. Second, the people you see 'confiscating' weapons are LOCAL PD, NOT THE US MILITARY OR THE LNG. SECOND, the 'troops' are LOUISIANA NATIONAL GUARD, NOT THE US MILITARY. You do know that the LNG is under control of the governor of LA, RIGHT?

AT NO TIME DO YOU SEE ANY LNG ACTUALLY GO INTO ANY HOME, ARREST ANY BODY OR CONFISCATE ANY WEAPONS.

LET ME REPEAT THAT. NOT ONE LNG SOLDIER CONFISCATED ANY WEAPONS ON THIS VIDEO. NOT ONE.

THE EVIDENCE YOU PRODUCE PROVES YOU WRONG.

You have ONE GUY talking how it would be terrible to have to shoot even one American. Except did you LOOK at where they were and what they were patrolling? A rich neighborhood with NO DAMAGE and NO ONE THERE. Yeah, martial law and confiscating weapons.

Did you LISTEN to the guy who was arrested and had his weapons confiscated and then he was released?

HE SAID, "they confiscated our weapons because they were BIGGER than the weapons they had".

UH, HELLO, if this guy had been working in concert with the whole neighborhood, the cops would NEVER have dared come into the area. OR if like all his 'rich neighbors' he had just left the city, then it would have just been the La. National Guard patrolling another unoccupied rich neighborhood.

TWO FAMILIES SHOWN, TOTALING THREE PEOPLE. ARRESTED BY LOCAL PD, then released. Expect the lawsuit that the NOPD will be having to respond to and pay these people to be very expensive for the NOPD.

And let me help you out here C. I won't have a "legal right to resist, unless you are ready to fight another civil and revolutionary war".

This is completely untrue.

You want to talk about SEMANTICS?

THE LEGAL RIGHT TO RESIST means diddly when four armed BG's are attempting to break into my house. Especially when there's NO law enforcement responsibility to 'protect and serve' which you seem to lean heavily on.

THERE ARE NO LEGALITIES HERE. NONE. THIS IS A BUNCH OF ARMED THUGS WHO GO UNDER THE AEGIS OF "LAW AND ORDER".

Kindly discuss the legalities of what happens after it occurs. What, you think criminals might not use the 'POLICE DEPARTMENT - OPEN UP' scam before breaking in your door? Wise up. Let the lawyers sort it out afterwards. If there is actually anything to sort out afterwards.

AS LONG AS YOU ARE ALIVE AND THE THUGS ARE DEAD, EXACTLY WHICH STORY IS GOING TO BE TOLD?

Did our ancestors worry about their 'legal right to resist' tyranny? I don't think so.

And I want you to tell me exactly how many neighborhoods that were being patrolled by the whole neighborhood were invaded by anyone and had their firearms confiscated?

NONE. THAT'S HOW MANY.

And just ONE LITTLE HINT. If you are going to 'arrest' someone and then confiscate their private property, DON'T DO SO WITH THE CAMERAS RECORDING IT ALL. As NOPD, City of NO AND the State of LA found out, you generally lose lawsuits that come out of this type of illegal activity. It cost them all large amounts of money in the settlement, which has several proviso's, one of which is the winner can't talk about how much money they were paid OR that the defendants admit they did anything illegal, as it sets a precedent that will come back to haunt them in the future.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Damn, this is really like screaming at a wall. Uh, I didn't produce any evidence that proves me wrong, someone else did and it substantiated the FACT that Americans had their guns UNLAWFULLY confiscated. You keep saying that it was the "rich neighborhoods and the cameras were rolling"...what does it matter?! It shouldn't have happened period. What about that don't you get? It makes no difference because it happened to a few and not a large group? Come on! And it's not completely untrue that patriot resistance to Martial Law will mean a civil and revolutionary war, again. Because Martial Law will come with tyranny and you will have to fight it, no if's, and's, or but's. Ever heard of State Department Document 7277? Check it out--see if you'll be able to stare in the face of the U.N. troops and say "no" without an incident...

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

anyone know of the website with the video that shows the cops pulling over 3 kids in a car and the kids say "i dont consent to a search officer". some sort of rights video....i know there was a thread on it but i cant find it.
thanks

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

Years back, the SCOTUS ruled that refusal to submit to search was not probable cause to search. It gets back to the pig tag line "if you have nothing to hide....". If another such case goes before the current court, that will quickly change.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Fireams
 

The first time I encountered that clip a couple of years ago, it had a pretty clever and accurate caption beneath it: pornography for Neocons.

Re: What if the Guberment bans and collects Firearms
 

I know I am just trolling your post, but let us all remember a certain whore from Bethlehem. And there is whore of Babylon, but that is entirely differnt story.